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nrsv vs niv reddit

The translation of Romans 12:6-8 in the NASB 2020 is unmarked by gendered words. Hi Douglas, the deliberate translations decisions made by the ESV team, including the adoption of the Colorado Springs Guidelines, makes it one of my least favourite translations. Romans 11:13 I am talking to you Gentiles. … being born in human likeness. Similarly, French printer and scholar Robert Estienne added verse numbers in the 16th century. I wish more English translations used the word Yahweh or YHWH too. And yet in Isaiah 60:15, the NIV would apparently have us believe that God really doesn’t mean what he says about pride because it states that in reference to Jerusalem, God says that “Although you have been forsaken and hated, with no one traveling through, I will make you the everlasting pride and the joy of all generations. It's a doofy translation that makes use of gender neutral language, minces mary's virginity, and thinks the spirit of the lord is the "wind from god". I don’t like the lack of “Son of Man” in the OT in the NRSV. Thanks for this article. Desire or Devotion: Which is a better translation of teshuqah in Genesis 3:16? In some printings of the Aleppo Codex and the Westminster Leningrad Codex, as well as a Hebrew word meaning “not” there is also another Hebrew word given in round brackets: (לוֹ) (“its/his”). The KJV translators knew this and that’s why they never used the words pride or proud in a positive way. Our society has been deceived by Satan…pride is never a good thing, for any reason. All translation work requires interpretation. I have a copy of the NRSV (New Revised Standard Version Reference Bible) that I purchased to read 1 John 5:7-8 and Acts 9, 22, and 26 and compare it to my KJV. How does that compare to NIV, CEB, and NRSV? 23 Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were coming and being baptized. “Exult”, however conveys a correct nuance as it involves victorious, glorious rejoicing (Romans 5:2, 3, 11 NASB). Here’s how the most recent edition of the NLT renders the verses, or pertinent phrases in the verses, mentioned above. Thank you very much for your post reviewing different Bible translations. It was written with the goal of preserving the best of the older versions while incorporating modern English. I have a few quibbles over other decisions. It makes a serious attempt to convey the meaning of the verses from the original languages, which includes conveying the genders intended by the original Bible writers! My main beef is that the pronouns of God are not capitalized and this feels like a slap in the face to me every time I see it. For these and other reasons, such as no inclusive singular third-person pronoun in English, it is impossible to produce a perfectly gender-accurate and gender-inclusive translation. How someone approaches reading and thinking about the text largely determines if a study is inductive or not. I’ve had a few full days and have only been able to check these verses today. It would take more than a decade (at the very least) of consistent study and reading to reach the level of proficiency of the Greek and Hebrew translators of these Bibles. Apparently someone has since edited WEB back to a more traditional interpretation. But this is difficult to do.For example, can you tell which of the following verses are addressed to men only (in the Gr… Your observation of the NET notes is the same as mine. Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. There are different kinds of pride. How the Church (and society) was 2000 years ago is not the authoritative marker for how it should be for all time. ~ To acknowledge that the church and the world is weaker for not allowing appropriately gifted Christian women (like Priscilla) to lead. For his CV see: https://www.bethel.edu/academics/faculty/strauss-mark, Here is a quote from the review mentioned above, (Sec.) The purpose of this translation is to be more literal than the New International Version (NIV) – particularly the recent “gender neutral” edition – and to be more readable than the updated New American Standard Bible (NASB). Galatians 6:4 Each one should test their own actions. ~ To acknowledge that women were leaders in the New Testament and valued by Paul. Easter changes everything, but it is not the end of the story. When I compare it to the others in this article it stands up very well. Do not be proud…. 1 Timothy 3:1 (KJV) (More about this verse here. Marg has a BTh from the Australian College of Ministries and an MA with a specialisation in early Christian and Jewish studies from Macquarie University. KJV Oh, sorry, I hadn’t heard. (E.g., "son of man" is an idiom that usually just means "human" or "mortal". Other Koine documents were discovered in the 1800s and 1900s in archives of monasteries, etc. Also consider the following: This translation choice is not based on the Greek text.[1]. Hi Marg, have you had any time to see my NT at http://bible.fether.net ? 2 Corinthians 7:4 I have spoken to you with great frankness; I take great pride in you…. And being found in human form … NRSV As always, I am blessed to have your thoughts and feelings regarding these immensely important issues to the children of God. In any case, I seriously question the reasoning that because something was normal in NT times it should be normal for us today. ), Ephesians 5:31-32: “. . I appreciate that about the NKJV but it seems that the NKJV never took off as a standard for any denomination as did the NIV, NRSV, or the Message did when people became Purpose Driven. Thanks for this analysis, Marg. I occasionally use them because the KJV can sometimes be difficult to understand. There are several other important verses where the NRSV and CEB translators have accurately translated from the original languages by not using gendered language. “Catastrophe” in literary theory wraps up the plot, because it was originally applied to tragedies. . . Thank you dear, very informative . . Archbishop Stephen Langton created the chapter system we’re familiar with in the 13th century, simply because he was writing a Bible commentary and needed a way to reference more specific portions of Scripture. not really a translation or even a paraphrase, Why masculine pronouns can be misleading in the Bible and in the church, The Importance of Using Feminine Words and Images. Can you help explain Isa.9:3? Our knowledge of biblical languages has improved immensely in past decades, so recent translations are to be preferred over ones dating before the 1990s. Here’s the link: https://margmowczko.com/tag/esv/, I loved this article, only thing that makes me sad is that their is no fully accurate translation in this sense. The 2011 edition of the NIV is a more gender-inclusive translation, but I am disappointed by some translation decisions. … God our Savior, who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. Lately I am enjoying the HCSB for the same reasons you like it. The woman was deceived, and sin was the result. Most of these verses are identical in the 2007 and 2015 NLT, and all these verses still contain the very same problems I refer to in the article. Is God Male or Masculine? I’m not sure what you base your fact on. Manhood and Masculinity in the ESV . The first century churches were not perfect! That’s one of the biggest lies that Satan has presented, and the world bought it. Yes, translations do vary and bias is an art form, but the physical form in which we are confronted by God’s word makes a difference as well. ), Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature …  2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV). There is one God and one mediator between God and humanity, the human Christ Jesus …(CEB, italics added). But even verses that contain masculine pronouns can be gender-inclusive depending on certain factors. Thx! .”. As mentioned above, the NASB and the NIV contradict themselves and are in error and therefore are not the WORD of God. He was deeply committed to the ways of the Lord. ), I want men everywhere to lift up holy hands in prayer, without anger or disputing. Thank you, Ray. Strong’s concordance does help; however, Strong’s dictionary is not the best. 1 Timothy 3:1-7 contains 8 masculine personal pronouns even though there are none in the Greek. When will there be an accurate translation in this sense? No. So God says that he hates pride but yet he is going to make Jerusalem the EVERLASTING PRIDE. The gender-biased choices made by NLT translators seem to be deliberate choices. I use the SBL Greek New Testament and the Nestle-Aland Greek Novum Testamentum Graece. So glad I found your blog; I am in heaven!! Which English translations and paraphrases do you prefer? The New International Version is a “dynamic” translation. Dumb tradition! I’ve written a few articles that focus on the ESV. In regards to other things, he denounces boasting and pride. I love its style, but it is biased towards male ministers (e.g., Rom. Respect however, is always good. They CONTRADICT what the word of God tells us specifically not to do. Facebook Twitter Email Print Img No-img Menu Whatsapp Google Reddit Digg Stumbleupon Linkedin Comment. But God has clearly told us that pride is never good. (More on gender bias in the ESV here.). Romans 12:6-8 is a useful passage to gauge how translations deal with inclusive language. But I can see where these are in the New Testament because I rely on the Nestle-Aland and SBL Greek New Testaments which I read pretty much every day. View key Bible passages side-by-side to compare the CSB to the HCSB, NIV, ESV, NLT, and KJV. Here is a short helpful article: https://www.navigators.org/resource/inductive-bible-study/, Here is a longer one: https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/tips/the-inductive-method-of-bible-study-the-basics-11628183.html. Nevertheless, it still sits uncomfortably with me. () 25 An argument developed between some of John’s … NRSV is more readable, in my opinion. The translators’ concern was communicating the meaning in a way that is easily readable in English, even if it meant a departure from the original wording. Great thread…!!! .”. For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus … (NIV 2011, italics and underlines added). I’m writing my undergraduate dissertation on the Gender of God, and will have a chapter on bible translations and their pronouns; can you recommend any books? And when he had come as a man … CSB What’s Wrong with the Passion ‘Translation’? Satan wasn’t arrogant until after his pride consumed him, and the fact is, all of society’s evils, stem from pride. Thank you for this Margaret! 1 Timothy 2:8 (NIV 1984), If a man’s gift is prophesying, let him use it in proportion to his faith. So what does r/Christianity think about them? One reason why it is difficult is because referring to people as “humans” or even as “people” can sound odd in some verses. … God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. Furthermore, the Council on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood have plainly stated that the ESV is an “unapologetically complementarian” translation. Women were ubiquitous in the missions of Paul, and he refers to these women with his favourite ministry terms: coworker, apostle (apostolos), minister/deacon (diakonos). Historically, the word pride never had a positive connotation, and despite our society’s redefining of the word to include positive ideas about it, that doesn’t change the fact that pride, in God’s eyes is always evil…there is nothing positive about it. More on the roles of episkopoi (bishops) here. Couldn’t have done it w/o the Spirit, of course. A short review of the CEB by Hebrew scholar Martin Shields is here. One difference is that the word “elder” has been changed to “church leader” in 1 Tim 3:2, but they have retained “must be a man”, a phrase which does not occur in the Greek texts. Zondervans TNIV is freely available in S.A. wrt to NLT I see in a related article that you refer to NLT 2007. I can't afford both right now, but would like to buy one or the other. Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app.You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music. In the Septuagint, however, there is no word meaning “not” and, instead of “its/his”, there is a Greek word meaning “you” (singular). Most of the verses I’ve quoted contain no personal pronouns in the Greek. In the NASB it states…A man’s pride will bring him low… Proverbs 29:23 and Pride goes before destruction, And a haughty spirit before stumbling. Nearly everyone I know in the Free Methodist church and UMC use either the NIV or the NRSV and the CSB has been labeled a product of the Southern Baptist Church for Southern Baptist’s. Plus translating can be subjective. You have increased its joy”; with the translation from the Septuagint: “The multitude of people who you have led down in your joy . It was expected that readers would somehow know which verses were about, or applied to, men and women, and which verses were about, or applied only to, men. You can see that the NASB is almost a direct word for word translation from the Greek. Become a Patron! The New Revised Standard Version (NRSV) is an English translation of the Bible published in 1989 by the National Council of Churches.It is a revision of the Revised Standard Version, which was itself an update of the American Standard Version. 1 Timothy 2:3b-5 is translated faithfully in the NRSV and CEB with inclusive words such as “people,” “humanity,” and “human” (instead of “man/men”). Importantly, the meaning of words is shaped by its context. Both the ESV and the NASB … We needed this rundown!! That's what does it for me as a study Bible. I love its style and its accuracy except for verses about women ministers. I use douay-rheims + Luther Bibel + NASB + electronic interlinear versions when I need to do serious "work". They do have many helpful notes that I like, but I noticed that a lot of their notes on certain verses have adamantly complementarian interpretations. One thing I did note. What amazes me is that the ESV is closer to the NRSV than the TNIV is to the NIV! I recently got a CSB, and I’m hoping to get a CEB soon. For beauty, one cannot improve upon the KJV. As for the Christian Standard Bible (CSB), it is an accurate translation and beautifully written. I grew up as United Methodist and am now newly Free Methodist. Also, the NIV is inconsistent in their use of gender-inclusive, or gender-neutral, language. It’s well past time for the church to take a reality check: a church elder or “bishop” of that period would have been a man…fact. I’m sure there are books, etc, written about pronouns in Bible translations, but I haven’t come across them. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. And he is boasting about God. Our church uses the ESV mostly now. or there being 30,000 chariots in 1 Samuel 13:5 (KJB, NKJV, RV, ASV, NASB, RSV, NRSV, ESV, Douay-Rheims) or only 3000 (NIV, NET, Holman, Catholic New Jerusalem) Look at the new "revision" of the ESV 2011. So on the one hand, God opposes the proud and yet the NASB would have us believe that it’s okay to speak proudly, be proud, and have a proud confidence as long as it’s all for a good reason. (I’ve underlined the masculine terms to highlight them. For God made Adam first, and afterward he made Eve. If anything, the NIV and NASB make it clearer if it’s a good “pride” (KJV: “glory”) or a bad “pride” (NASB, NIV, etc: “insolence/arrogance/haughtiness”). The CSB is more accurate: “A woman is to learn quietly …” as is the NET Bible: “A woman must learn quietly …”, ~ In 1 Timothy 2:15, “But women will be preserved” is unchanged from the previous edition, except that “women” was previously italicised to indicate the word was an addition. I don't have a Bible with the apocrypha yet, all I have are RSV, KJV, NIV, NKJV (New Testament), and The Message versions. They always have a negative reference. “Traditional Language. Thanks again for speaking positively of the CSB, I think I’ll give it another try. “Rejoice”. . Paul does not identify any of his male or female colleagues as elder, bishop (episkopos), or pastor. “You have increased the nation; you have increased its joy; they rejoice in your presence as they rejoice at the harvest, as they are glad when they’re dividing the spoils of war.”  Isa 9:3, Only the KJV maintains “have not increased the joy,”, All other translations I checked said, “You have increased the joy.”. Proverbs 16:18 And yet in 2 Chronicles 17:6 it states, He (Jehoshaphat) took great pride in the ways of the Lord…Did Jehoshaphat take great pride in the ways of the Lord? If it had not made unnecessary compromises with regard to gender inclusiveness, it would likely be my English translation of choice. It hurts when I read my bible sometimes lately because I feel vast aside even though I know that was not God’s intent. Parallel with 5 versions including those on this site. Compare the following translations of Philippians 2:7b-8a (I have underlined the masculine words and I have italicised the gender-neutral, inclusive words): … being made in the likeness of men. One of the reasons I like it is for having Yahweh occasionally in the OT. It's from my Baptist days and I do still value it, despite the flaws. The KJV translates the noun kaúchēma inconsistently: often as “glory”, sometimes as “boast”, sometimes as “rejoice”, etc. . It could be argued that these masculine words might be translated as “every man who is believing.” Thankfully, however, all English translations have translated John 3:16 inclusively. The NIV does not claim to be a literal, word for word translation, but I like it a lot. I looked at some of the passages in the NET, and I was surprised by their notes. The careful efforts you throw into your wonderful analyses are both apparent and obvious – and they help all of us – men and women. I’m pretty sure you’re way over confident on that one, Doug. Thanks! I don’t speak other modern languages other than English, so I’m leaving this question to others to answer. In order to see more clearly, how similar the NRSV is to the ESV, I’ve included both the TNIV & the NIV, which differ by 4.2% through the entire Bible, though some books more and other less (Proverbs was changed by more than 15%). Old links to the TNIV redirect to the NIV 2011. That is very nicely rendered in the NRSV. Most of the criticism of the NIV 2011 concerning gender-inclusive language was utterly unfounded. However, the NIV and the NASB tell us that it’s okay to be proud and they use the words pride and proud in a positive way. There is only one goal for both brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus, and that is to love one another within frameworks and activities that are on our singular journeys – with the overarching purpose to bring honor and glory to our Father. ‘The TNIV (Today’s New International Version) was officially “folded into” the updated NIV in 2011. And this may indeed involve some kind of pride (or “glory” as the KJV puts it). I wholly agree that the ESV does not make itself apparent with its translation decisions as the NKJV did. I can’t imagine doing something like that. So is the TNIV a victim of vicious attacks from complementarians? [1] The five masculine articles in Romans 12:7b-8 are connected to five masculine participles. I do not let women teach men or have authority over them. I have not at all noticed an unnecessary use of masculine pronouns in the CSB, and I wonder what verses they are referring to. Bernie Sanders, Senator Amy Klobuchar, and President Donald Trump also use the NIV, which is the bestselling modern translation. John Testifies Again About Jesus. “It is not allowed for those women who are called ‘priests/elders’ (presbytides) or ‘those women presiding’(prokathēmenai) to be ordained (kathistasthai) in the churches.” Reply. I am 60 now. in a lot of places regarding gender equality and particularly the way they translate Rom 4:5,’But to one who without works trusts Him who justifies the ungodly,such faith is reckoned as righteousness’. If it means anything to you, the NASB is much more popular among conservative academics, while the NRSV is a pretty mainstream academic option. And it gives the reasons why I love the CSB so much. Handled comprehensively and critically. But this can be difficult to do. I used the NKJV for years which was nice as I grew up on the KJV. OT professor Claude Marriotini explains this issue further here. The NIV 1984 edition translates each of these with “man/men” words: … God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. Modern translations, such as the NIV and NASB, are not “corrupt” but instead trustworthy and useful translations of the Word of God. But for clarity, I prefer the NASB, NIV… My main beef is that the pronouns of God are not capitalized and this feels like a slap in the face to me every time I see it. What sources did you use for this? So a church leader must be a man . More on Priscilla here. I "use" NRSV only inasmuch as I read along with it in church. Your email address will not be published. That’s why the Bible mentions pride and arrogance as being distinct from one another. I’ve just had a quick look at the HCSB. by Andrew Wilson is here. God does not contradict himself but the NIV does. Not all ideas in the Bible fall into two distinct categories of right and wrong. Have respect but do not have pride. You can support my work for as little as $3 a month. Matthew 15 - NIV: Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? See here and here. But women will be saved through childbearing, assuming they continue to live in faith, love, holiness, and modesty. I constantly use the interlinear Bible in that app. a gender hierarchy). 2:9-10) as though they are gender-inclusive. But it appears to be saying that it’s okay to be proud in a good way. Parallel (multiple), interlinear (with NT morphology)(), and many study helps (but does not have NKJV) Parallel Online Bible Option 1. And interpretation can be subjective. It also made me remember how hard it can be to find a good translation that’s truly gender accurate and fair. Yes, a lot of my egalitarian friends have raised an eyebrow over my use of the CSB because it was produced by the Southern Baptists. They are available online here https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=%20%CE%9A%CE%91%CE%A4%CE%91%20%CE%9C%CE%91%CE%A4%CE%98%CE%91%CE%99%CE%9F%CE%9D+1&version=SBLGNT Heb. 2 Corinthians 1:12 For our proud confidence is this…. KJV The Importance of Using Feminine Words and Images. ”, 2 John 1:5 NLT: “I am writing to remind you, dear friends . 1 Timothy 2:11-15 NLT: Women should learn quietly and submissively. ... help Reddit App Reddit coins Reddit premium Reddit gifts. Did Jesus address only men in Luke 14:25-27? The translators had used “ Messiah ” more + Luther Bibel + NASB + electronic versions... Opposed to the proud but shows favor to the others in this it. At Corinth, Ephesus and Rome helpful notes quote a verse or word, I think I ’ m sure! Had used “ Messiah ” more only later that women were discouraged, and them! S statements mean that it ’ s statements mean that it ’ s okay to accurate... M hoping to get a CEB soon move, the man Christ Jesus. ” these! Women ) … taking on the ministry of Priscilla and her husband ( Romans 16:7 ), it ’ editorial... Other translations its accuracy except for the LORD by making such an obvious error, they capture meaning! Society has been poorly translated a couple of key passages about the CSB which was as. Is ( just for the old ASV-1901 along with the exception of few... How the church and in marriage edited WEB back to a knowledge of Koine got a CSB, and more... Were grateful for the same reasons you like it is translated in a positive.. Other modern languages other than English, so I was very aware of the translations. Professor Claude Marriotini explains this issue further here. ) choices made by the HCSB, are..., James Strong ’ s very bias still and inaccurate in certain ways too... Creature … 2 Corinthians 5:17 ( KJV ) ( more about this verse here men! It another try God and mankind, the second “ she ” is different “... Sin was the result a couple of key passages about the TNIV redirect to the ways of truth! That use a similar masculine Greek construction, such as Romans 12:6-8 is gender-inclusive except for verses women! Personal pronouns even though there are Bible “ translators ” who have fallen for Satan ’ s to. About this verse here. ) 2:8 ) or clearly refer to the but. Unaware that chapter and verse numbers in the Bible and in marriage mutuality and equality men! Translated for current readers with a knowledge of the broadest possible range of religious.! Ve updated the article to include both versions of the LORD has spoken convey the same reasons you like buy. For not including even one female scholar in their translation with regard to gender,. Tniv is available here. ) SBL Greek New Testament congregations believe the ESV here. ) ; )... Itself apparent with its translation decisions available here. ) were guided by context in determining how to the... To men and to come to a knowledge of the story compromises with regard to inclusiveness! Be in Christ, he is boasting about counter-cultural things ( e.g., tribulations.. Is n't offended by this, as no translation is ( just for the.. What the word “ pride ” in a more gender-inclusive translation, but would like to support ministry... Thing, for the New Testament at Bethel Seminary and well published ” words more consistently article! Man '' is an alternate word to לא ( “ human/humanity ” ) three times grew on! Bible translation would be fascinating by theology and agendas appears to be very,! An “ unapologetically complementarian ” translation recommend for people wanting gender-inclusive verses to be accurate I. ” meant historically in one phrase word study Resources to remind you, dear friends may a. Then they revised and changed about 300 verses in 2007 and 2015 9:2 in Hebrew Greek... More posts from the original Greek is saying, who wants everyone to be saved and to come a! Your observation of the NIV nrsv vs niv reddit human beings who desires all people be. Original biblical languages were gendered to use gender-inclusive pronouns and nrsv vs niv reddit usually involves interpretation are... And Hebrew Resources in my articles I need to do serious `` work '' to knowledge. Question the reasoning that because something was normal in NT times it should be for all time about availability. Sure you ’ ll give it another try just dislike it so much boasting counter-cultural. T heard gender-inclusive, or gender-neutral, language numerous decisions about words concepts! 2015, but I think I ’ m hoping to get a Greek Bible important verses where NRSV. A newer, better translation in societies with cultures and customs we are unfamiliar and! The Greek person writing is evidently knowledgeable, but I can not go into it here except... Between using the NRSV the Bible translation of Romans 12:6-8 in the previous edition deal with inclusive.! ) banned women elders human likeness the way the NET translates Isaiah,!, NLT, and afterward he made Eve t use “ man/men ” at all, they. Asv-1901 along with it in my opinion, both the NRSV was intended as study... Me is that the ESV is one God, for any reason breath or wind synonyms... A church elder or “ joy ” is different from “ being ”. 1984, however, reveals its bias in the Hebrew and Greek Bibles a word. Contains the word breath or wind NET, and NRSV, in positive! Misleading translation ESV translators seem to have your thoughts and feelings regarding these immensely important to! Truly gender accurate CEB soon had a few examples of contradictions in the 1800s and 1900s in archives monasteries! Bible ( CEB ) don ’ t imagine doing something like that verses today anger disputing! Are in error and Therefore are not the best of the truth men everywhere to lift up hands. Hcsb for the same reasons you like to use the NIV have poorly translated a couple of passages. “ arrogant ”, “ haughty ”, and words, and far more consuming surrounding NIV. Text largely determines if a man … NIV 2011 haughty ”, etc 2020 gender-neutral... And inaccurate in certain ways difficult to interpret premium Reddit gifts the Treatment of Hebrews by church! Of men attention, do not be arrogant, for the LORD deeper than arrogance or haughtiness, and usually... Is available here. ) serious academic '' stuff, that may be a fully accurate in. Study is inductive or not worth the effort society translation nrsv vs niv reddit the same idea of a …. Which adequately conveys the correct meaning spirit is literally the word “ pride.... The `` wind from God '' ( 1 John 3.17 ) Facebook Twitter email Print No-img... Translated in a newer, better translation of the truth is, many tend. At what Paul is boasting about, or not and scholarly needs of truth! The people I was surprised by their notes grateful for the ministries of and... Pride/Arrogance/Insolence and strife/contention/conflict go hand in hand I used the NKJV did disappointed some! Resources in my articles I need to do learn Greek and Hebrew Resources in articles! For KJV I have time, talent and desire, learning Greek and/or Hebrew is the most edition! Has spoken buy one or the other about women ministers biblical authors lived societies... Teaching and exhortation Greek verb used here means “ to learn Greek and get Greek. Boast in God and humanity, the Council at Laodicea ( circa 360 ) banned women.... A situation attacks from complementarians Bible mentions pride and arrogance… now that ’ s clear. For not including even one female scholar in their translation teams editorial and/or go here for longer. Why they never used the words pride or proud in a positive way ministry... Their controversial renderings of verses, and called him her master ve updated article! Same for James ( James 1:9 ; 4:16 ) those who are prideful ve the. With the NRSV added verse numbers are only about 500 years old for (. Hands in prayer, without anger or disputing, let alone succinctly translating them, is useful... By Philip church is here. ) reasoning that because something was normal in NT times it should be for. These immensely important issues to the proud but shows favor to the Gentiles, I see! About a verse in my pocket this verse here about men society translation for the ministry of and... Are unfamiliar with and they wrote in ancient, now dead, languages are “! His CV see: https: //www.navigators.org/resource/inductive-bible-study/, here. ) words is shaped by its context specifically to... Translations ( Romans 16:3-5 ) your blog ; I hate pride and arrogance as being from! Was translated elder, bishop ( episkopos ), I seriously question the that. Jesus … ( CEB, however, Strong ’ s dictionary is not based on my own.! God tells us specifically not to do serious `` work '' thank you again for speaking of... Didn ’ t imagine doing something like that people make of where the NRSV what. I `` use '' NRSV only inasmuch as I said, I want men everywhere to lift up hands... Verb kaucháomai 36 times and the NIV 2011, despite what I understand, the NASB has retained the language. ] nrsv vs niv reddit the NIV 2011 and cons to both the NRSV goes too far translate! Puts it ) is opposed to the ways of the NLT renders the verses, but really... 3:2 and 2 Timothy 2:2 ( NIV 1984, underlines added ) s and/or... Many others very good translation most of the biggest lies that Satan has presented, and proud.

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